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Three Moves Ahead Episode 85: Betrayal and Manipulation

October 7th, 2010 by Troy Goodfellow · 7 Comments · Podcast, Three Moves Ahead


Julian and Rob are joined by Rob Daviau (Hasbro) and Chris Remo (Irrational) to talk about how games let us give in to our worst impulses and betray our friends. Neptune’s Pride, Risk, Weinhandler, Starcraft and a dozen other games come up.

Rob sounds very NPR in the intro. Then the whole thing goes to hell.

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Neptune’s Pride


7 Comments so far ↓

  • Clay

    So you’re saying the sound quality betrays your listeners, too?

  • Prof. Loewy-Brueller

    weinhändler [ˈvaɪ̯nˌhɛndlɐ]

    -verb (used with object)

    1. to deceive and misguide: After a while, it became clear the firm had weinhändlered all of its business partners.

    -verb (used without object)

    1. to play a game of Weinhändler: We were sick of playing Risk, so we weinhändlered.

    2. to avoid being deceived and misguided, often by deceit and misguidance: Having never experienced love, she learned to maintain relationships by weinhändlering.

  • Mind Elemental

    Not related to strategy games, but Rob’s comment at the end about not wanting to turn around and replay scenarios made me wonder: To what extent do the TMA’ers replay other genres, such as RPGs?

  • Tristan

    Really loved this episode, was a little surprised Solium Infernum didn’t come up considering the topic but a great listen even without Troy.

  • FhnuZoag

    I think the interesting thing with playing betrayal games, when there are more than 2 players, is that being mean will hurt you big time.

    The thing is, whilst the cruel move may give you a momentary advantage, it is very likely to either unite multiple players to take you down (and no one will ally with you again, of course), or convert a player into a grim avenger whose goal is no longer to win (especially if you’ve made that impossible), but to take you out at all costs.

  • Peter S (Mind Elemental)

    How did Dominions 3 not come up in the discussion? :D

  • Jorune

    For Memoir ’44, I always play the scenario twice from each side. I’m always fascinated to see how the other side see’s things. That said, Memoir ’44 now has a campaign book, where you play through a succession of battles, with each outcome affecting the next scenario you play. Rob, sounds like you would love this.

    BTW, Intrigue is the ultimate skrew your neighbor game: http://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/265/intrigue